Author Topic: George as a Witness  (Read 214088 times)

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Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1275 on: March 16, 2013, 09:07:15 PM »
Who else claims to have had a visual on the first laying on of hands?

It is well known that there are no other eyewitnesses to that.

If you want to mention that for the benefit of any readers who are new to the case, you could just say it, instead of making it a snide rhetorical question aimed at a straw man.


Offline unitron

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1276 on: March 16, 2013, 10:25:22 PM »
It is well known that there are no other eyewitnesses to that.

If you want to mention that for the benefit of any readers who are new to the case, you could just say it, instead of making it a snide rhetorical question aimed at a straw man.

So when someone says "witnesses", I'm supposed to know they meant witness?

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1277 on: March 16, 2013, 10:30:37 PM »
So when someone says "witnesses", I'm supposed to know they meant witness?

'Witnesses' doesn't mean 'eyewitnesses'.

'[W]here witnesses say the confrontation started' doesn't meant 'where witnesses say they saw the confrontation start'.


Offline unitron

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1278 on: March 17, 2013, 07:32:54 PM »
With how much precision will earwitnesses (other than the young lady) be able to pinpoint, location-wise, not time-wise,  the beginning of the physical encounter?

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1279 on: March 17, 2013, 08:27:43 PM »
With how much precision will earwitnesses (other than the young lady) be able to pinpoint, location-wise, not time-wise,  the beginning of the physical encounter?

Response on thread 'What Happened at the "T"?'

Offline unitron

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1280 on: March 18, 2013, 10:19:28 PM »
...The defense can emphasize...where witnesses say the confrontation started.  All of these are a heck of a lot more convincing than any self serving statement from Zimmerman...
Do the earwitnesses really do any good in confirming that things seem to have started somewhere roughly where Zimmerman says they did, or is it more that none of them contradict him?

Offline DebFrmHell

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1281 on: March 18, 2013, 11:43:37 PM »
Do the earwitnesses really do any good in confirming that things seem to have started somewhere roughly where Zimmerman says they did, or is it more that none of them contradict him?

I would think it is more the latter statement.  Zimmerman had no clue as to who else might have heard or seen anything other than W6.  For all he knew before he was transported to the station, W6 was the only person who saw anything.

I have always thought it kind of odd that none of the other witnesses have remarked that they saw Selma Mora.  She says GZ told her to call the police but he doesn't mention her either.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1282 on: March 19, 2013, 01:40:21 AM »

I have always thought it kind of odd that none of the other witnesses have remarked that they saw Selma Mora. 

I thought so too, until I looked more closely at the timeline.

More on Mora thread.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1283 on: March 19, 2013, 02:44:14 AM »
Responding to post on another thread.

one of the parts of the reenactment that always stuck out to me was Zimmerman mentioning something to the effect of Trayvon may have said something to him but he didn't hear it his windows were up and he was talking to the dispatcher. It always struck me as odd, because it seemed irrelevant. However, the fact he pointed it out does kind of imply that perhaps he thought Martin said something as he passed his truck.

I disagree with the paraphrase.

Reenactment, 3:46-4:00 
Quote
Zimmerman: And then he came back, and he started walking up towards the grass, and then came down and circled my car. And I told the operator that. He was circling my car. I didn't hear if he said anything-

Sgt. Smith: Right.

Zimmerman: -but he had his hand in his waistband.

Zimmerman didn't volunteer antything about Martin speaking the first time told this part of the story. Singleton asked.

2/26-1, 11:48-12:00
Quote
Zimmerman: And then he comes back out, and circles my car, while I'm on the phone with the police. 

Singleton: Mmmkay. Is he saying anything to you?

Zimmerman: I couldn't hear. My windows were up. As soon as I saw him coming up, I rolled up my windows and I stayed on the phone with dispatch.

Audio

In the reenactment, I think Zimmerman was just anticipating getting the same question, and giving roughly the same answer.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1284 on: March 19, 2013, 03:09:02 AM »
Zimmerman had no clue as to who else might have heard or seen anything other than W6.

I don't think we know that. Neighbors started coming out after the police arrived, and it was a while before Zimmerman was transported.

Gilbreath mentioned that in the first bond hearing. (Audio, complete; CNN transcript, with omissions at commercial breaks.)

Quote
GILBREATH: I have no indication what he picked up from other officers at the scene. I know from reading reports there were witnesses gathered around while he was still at the scene. And this was prior to their having statements taken from them. So I don't know what he picked up from overheard conversations.

Offline leftwig

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1285 on: March 19, 2013, 06:58:06 AM »
Do the earwitnesses really do any good in confirming that things seem to have started somewhere roughly where Zimmerman says they did, or is it more that none of them contradict him?

I'd guess some of both.  The witnesses on the end unit were sitting in their living room with the patio door to their screened in porch opened.  They could hear it raining and provided pretty good details about what they heard and the general area of the noises they heard throughout the progression (voices beginning to the left of their patio, movement in the grass behind their place, screams for help and movement of the commotion and screams to the south).   What the witnesses don't seem to be able to corroborate or contradict is if there was any contact before this exchange of words. 

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: George as a Witness
« Reply #1286 on: March 20, 2013, 01:41:50 AM »
Do the earwitnesses really do any good in confirming that things seem to have started somewhere roughly where Zimmerman says they did, or is it more that none of them contradict him?

I've laid the evidence out here and here. Draw your own conclusions.

 

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