Author Topic: Zimmerman Photo Released  (Read 4377 times)

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Offline unitron

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #15 on: December 04, 2012, 07:48:30 PM »
...  That one-sided altercation continued for a minimum of 38 seconds (recorded) and probably closer to a minute before witnesses decided the situation was serious enough to call 911.

...

The first 911 call came in at 7:16:11 PM and the shot was fired at 7:16:56 PM (if memory serves).

Are you saying the 38 seconds to which you refer occured prior to that first 911 call?

If so, what recorded it?

Offline Jack203

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #16 on: December 04, 2012, 08:21:35 PM »
MINOR injuries.

Compared to a major car accident.  Yes.

Offline DebFrmHell

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #17 on: December 04, 2012, 10:48:02 PM »
The first 911 call came in at 7:16:11 PM and the shot was fired at 7:16:56 PM (if memory serves).

Are you saying the 38 seconds to which you refer occured prior to that first 911 call?

If so, what recorded it?

No I am not saying that. 

I am saying that you can hear the helps for 38 seconds within that recorded call that has the shot.  Roughly 14 yells for help, IIRC, since I too am doing this from memory.   We are not sure exactly when the altercation started but it would stand to reason that the person doing the calling has to determine within their own mind that there is some seriousness involved before calling 911. 

So, TO ME, the altercation could total less than a minute.  Or even slightly more than a minute since there was movement.  I think once head meets cement,  that is a pretty good time to trying to get help.

The recording came through the 911 system.

Offline hexx

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #18 on: December 05, 2012, 03:49:38 AM »
When you said "scan of a Xerox of a fax of a printout" , who were you quoting?

It takes an effort to degrade digital data, that is by it's nature infinitely exactly reproducible. Digital data has no "generations" like film or analog tape.

To degrade digital photo by printing it out, scanning it again , faxing, printing ,scanning - sounds like an intentional effort to distort the facts. Not attributing to malice what could be explained by incompetence/ignorance,  though.


It's an analogous situation with the DD "tape".


Offline hexx

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #19 on: December 05, 2012, 04:06:25 AM »
another example of how degrade data was when somebody videoed, probably with a smart phone,  Zimmerman from the police station monitor displaying recording, losing details like scratches etc. After information is lost, there is no way to "enhance" it back, even if using "enhance" button in a computer program is a popular plot device in TV and movies. (Crump was probably thinking "CSI" when he said FBI has hitech to make his unprofessional crap recording good)

Well, actually there is a possibility to try to collate data from consecutive video frames, but it's kind of far fetched.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2012, 04:09:33 AM by hexx »

Offline FromBelow

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #20 on: December 05, 2012, 09:34:00 AM »
What does that even mean?

No, seriously--what does that--in your head--actually mean.

In your world, if I choose to strap on my .45 I lose some of my ability to defend myself? Or there's some sort of higher standard?

Self defense. I know it's an increasingly alien concept in the current day and age, but none of us have a duty to submit to a beating if we don't wish to.

Yea, that's basically it.

I think he interjects the "unarmed child carrying only skittles and tea" mantra into the middle of this kind of reasoning:

George wouldn't have had to suffer any injuries because he had a gun and could have shot Trayvon without suffering a scratch. So because he had "minor" injuries he's a lying murderer (self-inflicted wounds, someone did it to him to cover up, wounds happened at some other time, ran into a tree, etc. Any one of the many Trayvon cultist theories). Of course if George hadn't suffered any injuries then he would also be a lying murderer.

The Trayvon supporters are incapable of understanding what self-defense is all about. To them the only way George might be justified in acting in lethal self-defense is if he was already so badly beaten he was incapable of it or he was dead.

Reminds me of the dunking test for witches. If the accused drowned they were innocent. If they floated they were guilty.

Offline Evil Chinchilla

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #21 on: December 05, 2012, 01:50:01 PM »
When you said "scan of a Xerox of a fax of a printout" , who were you quoting?

I wasn't aware I was quoting anyone when I wrote that; quotation marks are also used to indicate that a description is not literal but figurative.

However, I suppose someone else may have already used that phrase to describe what was clearly a degraded, multi-generation copy of the original, and I was unconsciously repeating it.

Offline ThurmanMurman

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #22 on: December 06, 2012, 10:06:01 PM »

Compared to a major car accident.  Yes.

They’re also minor compared to major injuries. The photo may stir emotions but it doesn't change the facts.

What does that even mean?

No, seriously--what does that--in your head--actually mean.

It means there is a distinction between a) believing Zimmerman must sustain injuries to legally claim self-defense, and b) coming to believe Zimmerman is likely lying about the events and the fact he sustained only minor injuries given what he described reinforces that belief.

I’ll simply skip the weird gun rants since I’m not interested in engaging politically-driven “pro-gun” or “anti-gun” agendas.

Offline TalkLeft

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #23 on: December 06, 2012, 11:32:30 PM »
I’ll simply skip the weird gun rants since I’m not interested in engaging politically-driven “pro-gun” or “anti-gun” agendas.

Please use the button to report any such comments so I can delete them.
These forums are to discuss the case, not gun control or people's views of guns (or race or any other social  or political issue.)

Offline Lousy1

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #24 on: December 07, 2012, 05:40:38 AM »
They’re also minor compared to major injuries. The photo may stir emotions but it doesn't change the facts.

It means there is a distinction between a) believing Zimmerman must sustain injuries to legally claim self-defense, and b) coming to believe Zimmerman is likely lying about the events and the fact he sustained only minor injuries given what he described reinforces that belief.

I’ll simply skip the weird gun rants since I’m not interested in engaging politically-driven “pro-gun” or “anti-gun” agendas.


The injuries he received are only tangentially relevant to the issue of self defense. The real question is what injuries he could reasonably expect to receive if he had not stopped the beating.

The wounds, screams and John;s observation  tend to collaborate GZ's narrative.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #25 on: December 07, 2012, 05:43:33 AM »
These forums are to discuss the case, not gun control or people's views of guns (or race or any other social  or political issue.)

If not for the prevalence of certain views about guns and race, this case would not have been brought.

Offline annoyedbeyond

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #26 on: December 07, 2012, 07:15:20 AM »
Please use the button to report any such comments so I can delete them.
These forums are to discuss the case, not gun control or people's views of guns (or race or any other social  or political issue.)

I have to agree with NMNM here (don't tell him!). If it wasn't for guns and race this issue goes away quietly, and when people (like the poster you were replying to) bring it up as part of their own theory(ies), then it deserves to be talked about. No one is spending a great amount of time debating the larger issue of gun control.


Offline annoyedbeyond

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Re: Zimmerman Photo Released
« Reply #27 on: December 07, 2012, 07:29:02 AM »
Or, as an intelligent and meticulous poster no longer present had the audacity to suggest, he may be providing a false narrative; that is why the fact that he sustained ("given the gravity" of being armed, laughably minor, IMO) minor injuries is significant. Further, releasing the original colored-version of an old photo presents nothing new, although I'm certain some emotions are stirred up.

I'm wondering why my post asking what this poster meant by the sentence here seen in bold print was deleted. I was not debating gun control on a national level, merely attempting to understand why this poster feels GZ apparently had more of a duty to take a beating because he was armed.


 

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