Author Topic: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records  (Read 9017 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline FromBelow

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 497
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #30 on: March 01, 2013, 02:20:38 PM »
It's going to be interesting to see what Nelson does about this. My guess is that, whatever she does, she's going to put the blame on the defense and/or decide that the information the FBI may have is irrelevant since it's a murder case and not a civil rights case. i.e. the FBI investigation is irrelevant.

If so, and the state suggests in a hearing or at trial that there was a racial component to Trayvon's death, can't the defense argue that he FBI findings are relevant?

I guess my point is that if Nelson decides the information from the FBI civil rights investigation isn't relevant then the state shouldn't be allowed to suggest there's a racial component. If they are allowed to suggest such a thing then Nelson will have denied the defense information they need to refute the suggestion.

Have the FBI interview summaries been entered into evidence yet? If so, wouldn't that suggest that Nelson has acknowledged there may be a racial component to the case? i.e. the FBI investigation is relevant?

IANAL and mostly just thinking out loud.

Offline MJW

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1304
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #31 on: March 01, 2013, 02:30:25 PM »
It's going to be interesting to see what Nelson does about this. My guess is that, whatever she does, she's going to put the blame on the defense and/or decide that the information the FBI may have is irrelevant since it's a murder case and not a civil rights case. i.e. the FBI investigation is irrelevant.

I almost wonder if the defense is pursuing the issue partly in the hope that the state will argue that the civil rights aspect is irrelevant.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5447
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #32 on: March 01, 2013, 02:43:22 PM »
Maybe we are like those poor souls in Plato's cave trying to figure out what in going on on the outside by seeing some shifting shadows.   

I thought we always were. That's what the story was about.

Offline RickyJim

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1576
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #33 on: March 01, 2013, 05:54:46 PM »
What bothers me is that the shadows we see might be imperfect institutions chaotically interacting rather than some interesting content in the stage before it comes into the daylight.  Wouldn't it bother you if it turns out that right now you know almost everything interesting about this case, except the outcome?

Offline DebFrmHell

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 954
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #34 on: March 02, 2013, 01:45:54 AM »
I almost wonder if the defense is pursuing the issue partly in the hope that the state will argue that the civil rights aspect is irrelevant.

I get the feeling that they are trying to nip a federal charge when (if) they are successful in getting Zimmerman out of this mess.  Avoiding "the first bite on a different apple" with some kind of violation of civil rights RE: Martin? 

Methinks, if they are bored they should check out the violations incurred by Zimmerman at the hands of the courts and the SAO.  I am still PO'd that he wasn't present for the bail revocation.  Denied Due Process, IMO.

 Gonna have to be a pretty big rock in that sling.

Offline MJW

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1304
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #35 on: March 02, 2013, 02:48:04 AM »
I get the feeling that they are trying to nip a federal charge when (if) they are successful in getting Zimmerman out of this mess.

I doubt they're very concerned about a federal charge. Nothing in the released FBI interviews provides the slightest basis for a civil rights charge.

Offline DebFrmHell

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 954
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #36 on: March 02, 2013, 02:57:39 AM »
I doubt they're very concerned about a federal charge. Nothing in the released FBI interviews provides the slightest basis for a civil rights charge.

Agreed.  But I wouldn't put anything past them (all of them) at this stage.  I don't see how they got the Murder 2 charge pushed through but they did.  Besides, they have only released some 20+ odd pages of interviews.  Do you believe this is all they did?

IMO, they want Zimmerman broke.  Feels like they are trying to break him in others ways, too. 

Like I said, just IMO.

Offline FromBelow

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 497
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #37 on: March 02, 2013, 03:09:24 AM »
I doubt they're very concerned about a federal charge. Nothing in the released FBI interviews provides the slightest basis for a civil rights charge.
There doesn't seem to be any basis for a murder 2 charge yet here we are. While I agree it seems unlikely it's still something that might happen and the defense needs to keep that in mind.

Personally I think everyone on the LE side just wants this to go away. They know they don't have a case but now they're committed. I'd even go so far as to say state, defense, and even Nelson knows there isn't a case. They're all just going through the motions. A show trial so that the masses can see that 'justice' has been done by a trial and jury. Which may explain her denying the defense's motions especially Crump's depo. She may suspect/know that the defense is using discovery to prepare for post-trial civil suits and that they already have everything they need for an acquittal. I doubt state or federal will push other charges when/if George is granted immunity (not likely because 'justice' requires a trial) or acquitted. They're going to breath a sigh of relief and be thankful it's over. IMO.

EDIT: I think the real goal has always been to get George denied immunity so that Crump can proceed with civil suits. The trial is just a formality for Team Crump and the defense. IMO they know George will never be convicted. The main course is all the civil suits.
« Last Edit: March 02, 2013, 03:20:02 AM by FromBelow »

Offline unitron

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1060
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #38 on: March 02, 2013, 11:22:52 AM »
...  Maybe we are like those poor souls in Plato's cave trying to figure out what in going on on the outside by seeing some shifting shadows...

It's worse.  We're trying to figure out what went on outside by deciphering the stories told about the shadows by those who were in the cave at the time.

Offline TalkLeft

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1124
  • Rate Post +0/-0
    • TalkLeft: The Politics of Crime
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #39 on: March 02, 2013, 07:32:58 PM »
Whonoze comment deleted for mispepresenting his opinion as undisputed fact.  If he continues to do so, he will be banned. He has only been allowed to post here on a probationary basis. For the most part he has complied, but he seems to be slipping into his old habits and they won't be allowed here.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5447
  • Rate Post +0/-0
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #40 on: March 03, 2013, 05:57:41 PM »
I doubt they're very concerned about a federal charge.

I agree.

I looked into this early in the case. What I found was very reassuring, from Zimmerman's standpoint.

The bar for federal civil rights prosecutions is set very high. It's lower for state agents, but even notorious police shootings are often dropped after state acquittal, despite pressures similar to those in the Zimmerman case. It takes some egregious looking the other way at the state level before the feds take an interest.

Offline TalkLeft

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1124
  • Rate Post +0/-0
    • TalkLeft: The Politics of Crime
Re: FBI Objects to Judge's Order Compelling Disclosure of Case Records
« Reply #41 on: March 06, 2013, 08:05:55 AM »
Please stick to this case. Other cases and "the bar" for such charges are not relevant here.

 

Site Meter
click
tracking