Author Topic: Expectations for Week Two  (Read 8675 times)

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Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #30 on: July 01, 2013, 06:07:00 AM »
W19 (woman who mentioned "elderly man" who lived next door.)

Not next door.

On her 911 call, W-19 first said the 'elderly man' lived 'two doors down'. Later she said he might be up to four units away.

House map.

W-19's building is the one on the east. Each row of three buildings has two 6-unit buildings and one 5-unit one, so that the gap between each pair of buildings is opposite a unit instead of another gap. Of the two northern buildings, the western one is 5 units and the eastern one is 6 units.

W-19 was in the eastern, 6-unit building. She was in the 2d unit from the south end, which is the 5th unit from the north end, 2821 Retreat View Circle.

There is only one unit in W-19's building that is south of hers, 2811 RVC. Of the four units that are north of hers, we know who was in three. Counting from the north, the Manalos were in the first, Bahadoor and W-2 were in the third, and Cutcher and Mora were in the fourth, next to W-19's. That leaves the second, 2851 RVC, by default as the home of the 'elderly man'.

W-19 told Serino on 3/1/12 that she saw this man the next day, and 'he was out of town or something overnight'. I don't think I've seen or heard another word about him in discovery. (The part about the elderly man is about 2/3 of the way through the recording. Sorry I couldn't find it on YouTube.)

There are 3 other units in those two buildings that have yielded no witnesses, the southernmost in W-19's building, and the 2 southernmost in the western building. There were press reports saying that RATL was hit hard by the housing crash, resulting in many units being vacant. I wouldn't be surpised if 3 units out of 11, or 27%, had no residents at a given time. But we wouldn't know about the elderly man if W-19 hadn't mentioned him, so there may be other residents in one or more of those units, who weren't home or haven't admitted to being home.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #31 on: July 01, 2013, 06:59:55 AM »
Among the witnesses not yet called are W3 (woman who called 15 seconds before shot), Austin McLendon, W19 . . . W17 (John Good's wife), and W20 (Lauer's husband). I would think the state would likely at least call W3 and Austin McLendon.

Also Mary Cutcher and Sierra McLendon.

Why W-3, and why not the others?

I think it's quite likely the prosecution will call all of them, so as not to appear to be hiding anything. I think the most likely candidates for omission are Austin, Sierra, and Cutcher.

Austin I've already discussed.

If Sierra isn't used as a proxy for her brother, she probably has nothing to say except what she told 911, that she heard a sound she couldn't identify just before Austin ran into the house. She wasn't interviewed by SPD, FDLE, or either State Attorney's office, but she was deposed.

I've said that in my opinion Mary Cutcher is the worst witness, and in particular the most impeachable. I won't be surprised if the prosecution doesn't call her and dares the defense to, so they can be the ones to impeach her, hopefully making the defense look bad just for putting her on. Since Nelson has ruled against opinion testimony on whether screams/cries came from a child or an adult, Cutcher doesn't have much to say that helps the prosecution. What she can say duplicates Mora. From her admission to Ofcr. Mead, and on her 911 call relaying information from Mora, I think her statements are just falsely claiming to have accompanied Mora and to have seen what she saw. And Mora backs her up, which is why I have said that I think Mora will go down with Cutcher.

Offline RickyJim

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #32 on: July 01, 2013, 07:02:27 AM »
I disagree about Austin. There were two witnesses who actually saw the altercation: Good and McLendon. He's probably 15 years old by now. If he tells the truth, I don't know why the testimony should be an ordeal. His original statements supported Zimmerman's version. He saw someone in red on his back, screaming for help. Good mentioned that he didn't see Martin initially, so the fact Austin saw only one person may be somewhat confusing, but it's explainable. The defense included Austin's video deposition in discovery, so I expect he'll be called, and if necessary, impeached with his previous statements. I believe Austin's mother and her lawyer tainted his later comments. I don't see why the defense should be forced to forego a helpful witness because of what I suspect came close to witness tampering.
I don't believe McClendon knew that Zimmerman's jacket was red at the original time of observation.  At trial he would point to exactly where he was on the diagram so it might clear that up.  I am somewhat dubious about Good also.  For both, it might have been information learned later.  You can just tell if a color is light or dark in a low light situation.  Do we know whether or not Austin went out to watch again while Zimmerman was still there?

Offline Cylinder

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #33 on: July 01, 2013, 10:24:19 AM »
Why not? If using that word got the defense in trouble last week, I missed it.

"Drove his fist into Zimmerman's face" is Team Zimmerman's preferred nomenclature. They've said it like a dozen times already, I think.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #34 on: July 01, 2013, 11:28:03 AM »
"Drove his fist into Zimmerman's face" is Team Zimmerman's preferred nomenclature. They've said it like a dozen times already, I think.

Thank you.

Offline Cylinder

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #35 on: July 01, 2013, 12:38:29 PM »
OK. My Serino Prediction just went down in flames.

Offline Jujube

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #36 on: July 01, 2013, 11:11:49 PM »
"Drove his fist into Zimmerman's face" is Team Zimmerman's preferred nomenclature. They've said it like a dozen times already, I think.

You gotta wonder what the jury is thinking about all this....  I think they've said concrete at least a dozen times including the claim that Martin came armed with a concrete sidewalk. 

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #37 on: July 02, 2013, 01:57:21 AM »
the claim that Martin came armed with a concrete sidewalk.

That he armed himself with the sidewalk.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #38 on: July 02, 2013, 02:01:11 AM »
The lineup for 7/1/13, the first day of Week 2, was Nakasone, Singleton, Serino. It looks like the state won't call any of the remaining neighbor witnesses. It will be interesting to see which ones the defense calls.

Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #39 on: July 04, 2013, 06:41:43 AM »
The state will limit it's question to cause of death.

I reviewed the video of the part of Guy's opening statement that covered the autopsy (1:04:20-6:26).

It begins
Quote
And finally, ladies and gentlemen, you'll hear from the medical examiner.

I like this.
Quote
You'll learn that Trayvon Martin arrived for his appointment with Dr. Bao . . .

His last doctor's appointment. Isn't that sweet, and more than a little creepy? Just think of the emotional associations being triggered there, especially for the jurors who are parents.

That's what predominates in this part of Guy's opening - various poetic ways of harping on how the victim in the murder case is, who would have thought, actually dead. I expect to hear a lot more of that on the direct of Dr. Bao, priming the jurors for Sybrina.

Guy's substantive points:

TM was 5'11" and weighed 158 lbs. His hands weren't swollen, and the only injury to his hand that could be photographed was a small abrasion on his left ring finger. [TM, says Guy, was right handed.] TM's chest had burn marks ('stipples'), 'just like the shirt'. The path of the bullet was straight through the heart.

I don't think TM being right handed would be an autopsy finding. Guy didn't say what evidence would support it. Sybrina can testify to it, but I would think they would want something more neutral/objective. Does anyone recall any evidence on the point being presented?

Saying the burn marks in TM's flesh were 'just like' those on the shirt, nicely glosses over how it's really only the ones on the shirt that support a contact shot.

On direct, I think Dr. Bao will be asked about all of these things. That's TM's measurements, the condition of his hands, the stippling, and the path of the bullet. He will say that the stippling shows the gun muzzle was close, and on direct he won't be asked 'how close'. But the door will be open.

Bottom line, I think I was wrong, and AnnoyedBeyond was right. I think Dr. Bao will be on the stand for a while.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2013, 06:49:39 AM by nomatter_nevermind »

Offline annoyedbeyond

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #40 on: July 04, 2013, 07:11:01 AM »

Bottom line, I think I was wrong, and AnnoyedBeyond was right. I think Dr. Bao will be on the stand for a while.

Do they sell Powerball tickets on July 4th?


While reading your post I started to wonder--maybe Sybrina won't be the final witness. Maybe Guy meant it literally when he said "finally, you'll hear...".

Put Sybrina on, she'll be all dignified, not teary, maybe just a little teary, she'll say that was his voice and not a lot else because Don West can ask some pretty hard questions while sounding really sweet if she opens the door about what a sweet kid TM was.

Then they bring out Bao and Guy (probably Guy, I think) goes full Jack McCoy on the direct.

The more I think about it the more I even wonder if Sybrina will testify at all. Other than a voice ID, what can she say that won't open the door to TM's character, or their apparent estrangement, or whatever else? And if she only trots up there and says "that's my baby screaming for help" and nothing else, what's that say to the jury?


Offline nomatter_nevermind

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #41 on: July 04, 2013, 10:11:45 AM »
Gossip/speculation  just heard on CNN, that TM's brother may testify tomorrow, plus ME and Sybrina. They don't seem to have heard the 'just one more' rumor, report on 'good authority'.

I was wondering if they were only going to have one voice witness. I'm thinking they may have been planning only the ME and Sybrina when they hoped to get done on Wednesday, then broadened the line-up when it turned out they would have to go another day anyway.

Offline annoyedbeyond

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #42 on: July 04, 2013, 10:59:04 AM »
Is that the brother that said (paraphrasing) that it wasn't Trayvon but it might be but he didn't know but it could maybe possibly?

Offline jeanmarc8

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #43 on: July 04, 2013, 11:52:07 AM »
IAMAL, and I have not been following this as close as others. 

I will comment on the apparent lack of favorable “personalization” of TM in the court proceedings. To my review, there has been relatively little information presented on TM, “the person”.  W8 provided some of that personalization, though how favorable that image was is open to discussion.  SF may provide some of that in her pending testimony; though as his mother she will likely be considered biased.

There was no school teacher called to provide some positive educational insights. There was no church pastor to vouch for his spiritual side. There was no coach from football to recollect some team contributions.  There was no “best friend” to recall humorous events.  The jury may be left to wonder about the “real” TM in their deliberations.

For GZ, there has been a lot of video in the trial from the police interviews and some background information as well. The testimony provided has often had some positive component. He has been present in court and visible to the jury for several weeks, and I would expect them to notice his personality. 

This seems to be in contrast to the media reporting for the 16 months between the event and the trial. For that period, favorable content for TM and negative content for GZ seemed to predominate in my view. This was even more apparent in the blogs. 

Perhaps MOM succeeded in his strategy with the veiled threat on negative material should the prosecution chose to open that door. 

Again, IANAL.

Offline TalkLeft

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Re: Expectations for Week Two
« Reply #44 on: July 05, 2013, 01:51:03 AM »
good observation, Jean Marc.


 

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