Author Topic: Defense Closing  (Read 11054 times)

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Offline TalkLeft

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Defense Closing
« on: July 12, 2013, 06:01:44 AM »
Mark O'Mara will deliver the closing argument for the defense this morning. Here's a thread for both live updating and comments. If you are reading this before it begins and want to comment about what you expect, please post in thread for the defense closing in Trial Expectations.

Offline teresainpa

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #1 on: July 12, 2013, 06:52:51 AM »
whole Martin family walked in and sat down ten minutes in two MOM's closing.

O'Mara talking about standard set for "Reasonable doubt".


Offline RickyJim

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #2 on: July 12, 2013, 06:53:19 AM »
I started listening about 10 minutes late and 10 minutes later O'Mara is still talking down to the jury.  I am unimpressed.  When is he going to get down to business?

Offline cboldt

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #3 on: July 12, 2013, 06:55:43 AM »
I started listening about 10 minutes late and 10 minutes later O'Mara is still talking down to the jury.  I am unimpressed.  When is he going to get down to business?

How should we know?  How do you know everybody (or anybody!) shares your definition of "get down to business?"

Offline teresainpa

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #4 on: July 12, 2013, 06:57:17 AM »
O'Mara telling jury they are living the constitution, impressing them with fact that they are the wall against the government and the injustice of finding some one guilty because they might be guilty. 

Offline annoyedbeyond

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #5 on: July 12, 2013, 06:57:51 AM »
How should we know?  How do you know everybody (or anybody!) shares your definition of "get down to business?"

Or even his definition of "talking down". I think O'Mara's connecting with the jury in a way Bernie certainly didn't with his screeching and hollering.

Ricky would b*tch if he were hung with a new rope, as my best friend (a Texan) would say.

Offline teresainpa

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #6 on: July 12, 2013, 07:00:41 AM »
I disagree RickyJim, I think he is doing exactly what he needs to say and that he has been somewhat inspiring in reminding jurors of their part in a great system of justice as written by the founders.

Offline RickyJim

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #7 on: July 12, 2013, 07:01:34 AM »
Anybody can make out the markings on O'Mara's thermometer?

Offline cboldt

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #8 on: July 12, 2013, 07:05:36 AM »
O'Mara showing a "reasonable doubt" chart, with not guilty at the bottom, guilty beyond a reasonable doubt at the top, and a set of maybe 10 in between grades, including "maybe guilty" and "guilt highly likely."  Guilt highly likely is not guilt beyond a reasonable doubt.

Then he produces another chart which is the inverse for disproving self defense.  "Unlikely self defense" = not guilty.  "Less than likely self-defense" = not guilty.  "Highly unlikely it was self defense" = not guilty.  The state has to prove to you, beyond a reasonable doubt, that Zimmerman did not act in self defense.

He offers to the jury, that if he (O'Mara) is misspeaking the law as far as burden of proof, prosecutor Guy can correct him later.

O'Mara says that he will now show why, beyond a reasonable doubt, Zimmerman acted in self defense.  He tells the jury not to confuse this with the state's burden.  Starts with "cop wannabe."

Offline RickyJim

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #9 on: July 12, 2013, 07:06:52 AM »
I have been thinking for years about what reasonable doubt means.  It is a confusing concept.  He should have emphasized that the state must show all innocent explanations are unreasonable while the defense must just make you aware of one reasonable innocent explanation of events.

Offline annoyedbeyond

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #10 on: July 12, 2013, 07:07:13 AM »


He offers to the jury, that if he (O'Mara) is misspeaking the law as far as burden of proof, prosecutor Guy can correct him later.

Which is what about all the "experts" said if only Bernie had said yesterday it would've helped when he started spinning fiction.

Offline cboldt

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #11 on: July 12, 2013, 07:14:07 AM »
While he is talking about Zimmerman's wannabe cop, etc., he has left the burden of proof chart, as it relates to self defense, on the easel, in view of the jury.

What else did they show you to demonstrate ill will toward Martin?  Five phone calls to NEN.  You heard them, and there is a sixth one you can listen to it, the state didn't play it for you because it didn't support their case.  The state doesn't have to show you good stuff about Zimmerman.  Also put into evidence, but didn't show it during trial, police reports of what happened in RTL.  Those will show burglaries, and you will see a rash of burglaries, and the only people arrested were young black males.  He'll get to that later (but it shows reason for having suspicion, and fits Zimmerman's NEN call).

O'Mara mocks the sound of an angry caller, and says to not let the prosecutor put their tone into Zimmerman's voice.  Asks the jury to consider if Zimmerman's tone is appropriate, or inappropriate.

Moves on to events of Sunday, February 26th.  Describes shopping for food to make sandwiches

Oh, and what witness said that Zimmerman patrolled the neighborhood?  There is not ONE who will say that they know Zimmerman as the guy wandering around the neighborhood, policing garbage cans.  The prosecution may want you to assume that, and you would have to assume it, because you can't find it in the evidence.  There is not one fact in evidence.  "Another point for Mr. Guy, if I am wrong about that, he can correct me."

Offline teresainpa

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #12 on: July 12, 2013, 07:16:58 AM »
MOM is too good.  I will try to blog this but I am enthralled.

"Not one witness said GZ patrolled the neighborhood as some sort of crazy cop wanta be"

Offline cboldt

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #13 on: July 12, 2013, 07:17:27 AM »
I have been thinking for years about what reasonable doubt means.  It is a confusing concept.  He should have emphasized that the state must show all innocent explanations are unreasonable while the defense must just make you aware of one reasonable innocent explanation of events.

This case isn't even close to that confusing line.  O'Mara is describing this case, and he said he was going to show that Zimmerman was justified in use of force, in self defense, and even though he doesn't have to, he will prove that beyond a reasonable doubt.  I think he'll close that line of argument by saying, and referring to the chart, but even if you don;t find this to be "here" (pointing at the white end of the chart, innocent), what I have shown is at the other end of the state's burden, to disprove justified use of force.

Offline annoyedbeyond

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Re: Defense Closing
« Reply #14 on: July 12, 2013, 07:18:35 AM »
MOM is too good.  I will try to blog this but I am enthralled.

"Not one witness said GZ patrolled the neighborhood as some sort of crazy cop wanta be"

That's the thing, he's really good with his presentation and mannerisms, he's drawing you in instead of repelling you like Bernie did with his hollering and high pitched squealings.

I want to know where O'Mara's going, I wanted Bernie to shut up and stop assaulting me.


 

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